Kevin Howard, Partner with Rancho Mesa, interviews Jeremy Dentt of Dentt Properties Inc. and explores a range of topics relating to innovation and problem solving in the commercial construction world.
Kevin Howard: Welcome to StudioOne™. I'm Kevin Howard, Partner here at Rancho Mesa Insurance. Very excited to have our guest today, Jeremy Dentt. Jeremy, how are you doing?
Jeremy Dentt: I'm good. Thanks for having me. First time podcaster here.
KH: First time podcaster. I feel privileged. Jeremy Dentt is the owner of Dentt Real Estate Services. He's been specializing in the development, management, leasing, and sales of commercial real estate since 2004.
Jeremy, you mind if I go through your resume really fast? Geez, Louise. 19 years of experience in commercial real estate, which officially makes you a guru. San Diego State Aztec, and I'm looking through the development and management, you just have a ton of different types, a multitude of developments: commercial, habitational, gas stations. Which one of those was your favorite?
JD: I would have to say that my favorite is industrial. It's easier, four walls, some concrete, less chaos to the mix of the development where gas stations, carwashes; lots of moving parts, lots of different subs and smaller lots to build on.
KH: Makes more sense, it's more concise, less of a busy zone. And that would be your ideal build.
Well, we're going to go over some commercial real estate topics that I think.a lot of listeners are maybe asking themselves, you know, “What’s going on out there?” There’s been a ton of change since COVID, a ton of change nationally, internationally, so, just really excited to dive into this.
Let’s start with this question; if you could solve one major challenge in the commercial real estate industry today, what would that challenge be and what would you do?
JD: Well I think the biggest challenge we're still facing in commercial real estate, and just the building industry in general, is the escalating costs. We had huge spikes during COVID and we were hoping for a softening post-COVID but, some things have slowed down. It's still challenging to get material on time, costs are still going up, specifically switch gears are a year out from manufacturing to delivery to the site which presents just a major challenge to getting a project out of the ground.
KH: So you're estimating for a project to be, you know, six months, seven months, and you're way behind just because of how the economy is just so slow right now?
JD: Yeah, the supply chains are still on a significant delay for certain parts. Most of our projects that we started in the last three years, we ordered some of the important items like the switch gear and any large equipment six, seven months before even signing up a contractor.
KH: Right, frustrating, but what would you do to solve that problem? You know, you have a magic wand and you're like, "Hey, this is the big fix."
JD: That's a great question that I don't think there's one easy answer. I think having a little bit more manufacturing in the States would help. Some of the shipping logistics was the biggest challenge, getting it across seas. If we had more opportunity to manufacture some of these products locally, I think it would be easier for us to streamline the process.
KH: Totally agree. Your career spanning, you know, 20 plus years, what was the defining moment if you could just name one in your career so far, as far as a commercial real estate developer?
JD: Yeah, I think for me, I started my own project in 2019. It's an industrial complex, seven buildings in total, broken up into two phases. In the first phase, we got out of the ground in early 2019. And as you know, in 2020, March, we hit COVID and the world shut down. And I specifically remember the moment in this development when I was sitting there looking at my Excel spreadsheet with all my costs; my loan, which was a personal guaranteed loan of over $6 million and the world shutting down and wondering, what do I do next? And there's actually a funny picture of me laying in my backyard face down in, you know, March, where it's still 75 degrees here, I'm outside lying face down with a Patagonia jacket on just contemplating the decisions I've made.
KH: Yeah. “Where do we go from here?” Perfect timing, right?
JD: Yeah. I think for the defining moment side of it, it made me realize that I'd worked on this project since 2012 and we timed everything as best as we could. But there's so many factors in real estate and just anything you do that can come out of nowhere, that blindside you. And so having important economics to the deal is more important than ever because tomorrow something can change. And in that instance it was a global pandemic that I did not factor in my investment performance. But it was still a great project in a great location and luckily things turned and we did just fine but it was certainly one of those moments where it constantly changes your risk assumptions and how much risk you're willing to take on given that nothing's guaranteed.
KH: Right. Nothing is guaranteed. And obviously, that project is done. I've seen it. It's beautiful.
JD: It's done. It's insured by you, which is great. It's financed. So, yeah, it turned out to be a really good project for us.
KH: It worked out. Let's switch over to some innovation conversations. What innovations are you most excited about? I know there's just so much change with AI and, you know, remote workers What are you excited about when it comes to innovation?
JD: Well with innovation and construction and, you know, development of commercial property I've been really tracking more of the AR technologies that are coming out. Specifically, I've been working on a lot of construction projects where I'm out there, kind of old school, with a set of plans looking at details making sure the contractor built it right and I've lately come across these Apple goggles.
KH: Apple Vision Pro, the augmented reality. So cool, right?
JD: The augmented reality. Yeah those I really like and I've been tracking some of the programs that you can get where instead of the old school way of walking around with blueprints and checking the details making sure it's getting built right, the AR goggles you can build in the architectural plans with all the overlays of all the MEP sheets. And instead of looking down, they're essentially cast in front of you in the building and so if you had questions about, you know; the structural components behind it or what's behind that drywall or is that plumbing line supposed to be there? The plans are in front of you in these Apple goggles.
And I just think about how much efficiency will be brought to the construction industry when you're essentially staring at the plans while standing at the project. I think it's going to be huge for the construction industry in terms of not missing things. For instance, like right now I've got a project that I'm really concerned about some of the waterproofing and I can't get those layers pulled out. And I'm not sure that the details perfectly followed because there's some missing elements there. So now we're going to pull back some of the panels and make sure it's all there. However, if we had these technologies at the start, it'd provide one more opportunity for them to make sure that they're getting it right.
KH: That layer of comfort for you, right? Because you can see it.
JD: Absolutely.
KH: Yeah, I think that AR is definitely, it's going to come fast. It's going to affect how we train everybody in different industries, but it's definitely going to create more accuracy. You know, you can see it. It's right in front of you.
JD: Yeah, the technology doesn't just span construction. We're seeing it every year in the property management. You know, my company is unique where we do development, we do property management as well. It actually, the property management feeds itself from the development because understanding how the building is built is as important to managing it as well.
But, the technology there is constantly changing. Just coming into your office, looking at these elevator systems that have negative air systems now post-COVID, self -cleaning buttons. The property management software is changing, the connectivity between you and the tenant is easier than ever. It's really about streamlining that connection. And I always tell my clients that we incorporate these new technologies to connect us to the tenant, to get the rents paid, to get the tenants needs taken care of, but it's not to lose that connection with the manager. These types of technologies actually free up our time more so that we can be connected to the tenant base, which is important. They want to know their manager; they want to feel like they're being heard. And these programs are to kind of get rid of the minutia and streamline whatever it is, maybe a maintenance call, getting them connected to our vendor so that we can open lines of communications for other things.
KH: Right. It frees up the opportunity cost for you to go do other things, plug in your time. I mean, those are the advancements that we're so excited about.
JD: Yeah.
KH: I'm imagining listeners that are interested in commercial real estate would have some questions for you having to do with the future. What are you seeing in 20 years from now? You know, 20 years ago, if we talked about AR, augmented reality, we'd be like, “What?”
What's on the horizon and what would be really cool?
JD: Well, I think that one's more of a challenge for guys like you and I that are born and raised in San Diego. Perfect example, 25, 30 years ago, downtown San Diego was never on my radar. I didn't think there was any opportunity to develop. As you know, when we were kids, it wasn't the safest area to go. For me, I remember going down to Old Spaghetti Factory and my pops would drive up to that front door, open the minivan, say, “Get out, go inside.” Then he'd come in hour later, said, “Wait at the door,” minivan comes around, open, jam in. That was my understanding depiction of downtown, right? And then all of a sudden this ballpark comes in and everything explodes down there.
I think it's part of what I'm talking about of what 30 years looks like, density, right? We are out of land in San Diego. Single family homes, building them is a challenge. We just don't have big tracks to put it together. You'll get your small pockets here and there, but the reality is, is most of our housing is going to come from density. And you've seen it in downtown San Diego. You see constant sky rises going up. You're seeing it more in North Park than ever before with the cities updating their community plans for denser locations near freeways. And so I think that the 20, 30-year outlook for San Diego is just a completely different sky rise. The single family huts that we grew up in East County, all those areas will have to accommodate growth, and we’re out of land. So how do you do it? You go up.
And I think that's honestly, we're seeing it even in industrial. It hasn't hit San Diego, but in markets like Seattle, Oakland, New York, they're building two and three story industrial buildings now. Those same markets are constrained with land. And so how do you create more industrial space?
KH: Go up.
JD: You go up. It's expensive, but at some point it does make sense. So I think just a vertical skyline is going to be the future of San Diego.
KH: Right, and that reminds me of the book Ready Player One that I asked you to read years ago.
JD: Sure, what a great recommendation.
KH: And that story, the stacks are stacked high because of that same problem, right?
JD: Sure, hopefully, we don't lose the social interaction that is lost in that world, but the density, I agree.
KH: We shall see. We'll listen to this podcast later on in life and say, "We were way off," or "You nailed it." So, we've talked about innovation. We've talked about the future of commercial real estate, what are you doing for risk management? What are you doing out there to really mitigate major risk?
JD: Yeah, I think that's one of the biggest things where we constantly look into. First things first is hire a good insurance agent, like you, to ensure the entire portfolio and be as cost effective as possible.
At a property level, we're encouraging all of our owners and looking at our own assets and trying to add cameras. I think from a perspective of risk for litigation, having captured more data on your building; what people are coming and going, what happens when they're at their building, I think is one of the best things that you can do. It doesn't help proactive. Of course, we got to stay proactive with getting eyes on our property, checking to make sure that everything's in good order. We don't want broken concrete. We don't want tripping hazards, all the kind of normal checks. But inevitably things are going to happen, right? And so mitigation of that risk after it happened. Well, not to say anyone lies about trip and fall on a property, however, having an understanding of what happened can be a defensible situation for us. And so having cameras at our properties to pick up on any activity of what may or may not happen is something that we're trying to roll out across our portfolio. And we do it on our large properties, which cost a little bit more because you have a bigger area to capture, all the way down to the properties that we represent that are one and two units. And this can be achieved with even installing a ring camera that has the ability to just capture an area.
And what we found is in these situations if something arises, we understand what happened so we can defend or acknowledge the situation and oftentimes it's just using it as a defense opportunity. The risk perspective is, we got to hand it over insurance and then our insurance premiums go up, right? So, doing as much to the building as possible to protect us and keep our claims low.
KH: I think it's especially very timely as far as adding a control, adding something to invest in that will just pay benefits over the long run If you do have a claim like that. It’s the same with commercial auto right now like, “Hey, so what happened?” Is it he said, she said or oh, “Here's the footage, we have it right here.” So that's really smart.
JD: Great point. Yeah, it's no different than insurance policy to us. It helps after the fact of collecting the data and understanding. And on an amenity base for tenants, they're actually finding a lot of value in it.
So we've got two high traffic buildings, one in Chula Vista and one in Escondido. And now multiple times I've provided footage for a tenant or a client of the tenant that reached out and said, "Someone backed up into my car." And I provided them the make, the model of the vehicle and they were just blown away like, "This is fantastic. This is what my insurance needed. They know it's not me.”
KH: I love it.
JD: What they do with it, I don't know, but it at least helps them on their side.
KH: Right.
JD: And so, we've been really trying to push for a lot of that.
KH: This is really innovative and can't cost too much either, right?
JD: It's coming down in price. I remember when I started, you would look at it and it just didn't make financial sense. But with the wireless connectivity, which is the most challenging part, because you don't want to be running wires 600 feet down the building, right? In a conduit, it all starts adding up. But with the new wireless capabilities and the quality of these videos, it's cheaper than it's ever been.
You know, I do all these things, right? And I put in all these checks and balances for my buildings. My most recent project, that you're aware of, is the ESFR rated fire system. The best you can get. If anything catches fire there, that fire system is going to suppress. But, the industry in general, every year, not every year, I should say the last couple of years, we've seen it premium spikes. And the comments have been, “Well, there's been a lot of wildfires, there's been floods.” Nothing that's been extremely detrimental to my properties or in my location, but my premiums continue to go up. I'm curious is why are outside events affecting my properties?
KH: That's a really good question. I think that, you know, we see premiums go up and we're wondering, “Hey, time out. My portfolio was not affected, you know, I'm so far away from these fire zones.” In reality, you know, I have some statistics in front of me. In 2023, 7,127 wildfires. The year prior, 7,667 wildfires. Both years ranging $10 billion to $ 15 billion and paid out insurance costs.
So, your insurance companies, they're buying reinsurance. They're buying insurance on top of insurance. Those reinsurers, they're getting killed. Hurricane Milton, for example, has an estimated $60 billion payout. So when we have these disasters internationally that are taking a huge hit and these re-insurers are taking a huge hit. The pressure passes down to the insurers and ultimately the consumer, right? So we'll see the effect of Milton and Hurricane Helene. But that's the long and short of it is you can have the best controls in place, but because of what's going on with natural disasters, Unfortunately, you're seeing the effect.
And then one more added layer is the cost of goods. Like you mentioned, you know, gas prices being up, money costs more. If there is a situation where a building has to be rebuilt, it costs way more now than it did 10 years ago.
JD: Sure.
KH: So you combine those two together and, you know, that's why we're seeing premiums go up. And the best way for us to really help you fight, you know, at commercial real estate portfolios, you know, fight down those costs, is to communicate early with your insurance agent, make sure they know everything about those controls that you're talking about. Do you have the cameras? And what else are you doing that really helps us mention that to the marketplace and find savings where we can find savings?
JD: So my mitigation of risk can transfer over to their mitigation of risk and hopefully, maybe move the needle of premiums?
KH: I mean, for example, we talked about property premiums going up. General liabilities are usually a good portion of your total insurance costs. Can we push that down? Should we raise the deductible? Are we fighting for the best rate on that? We got to fight where we can fight right now when we have no control, we're completely powerless over what's happening in the property marketplace.
Similar to homeowners right now that live in these fire zones, paying five, six, seven thousand dollars a year in premiums. They weren't expecting that. They didn't budget for that. So we have to just hold tight, be as creative as possible, and really dig deep as far as how we market your account and how we fight for credits.
JD: Yeah, I agree.
KH: We've covered a lot of ground here. We've talked about how you're mitigating risk. We've talked about the implementation of new technology. With everything that you have under your belt, who can you help right now? Who's out there that might need your services?
JD: So our focus is twofold. We're looking for clients and partners that have land or a building that has some type of value-add lift that needs someone with expertise of construction, ownership, and management. And then also over the past five years, we've added multifamily into our portfolio. Which, the landscape of San Diego has changed from a few small developers and managers to multi-billion dollar companies. And so being just focused in one silo of commercial real estate presented challenge. So we pivoted and took what we experienced in commercial real estate, which is a higher level of care and trust for a building and added that to our multifamily portfolio.
So there's a lot of families out there that are self-managing their own portfolio, whether it's a three unit, four unit or a couple hundred units that the family was doing on their own. They're reaching that point of retirement where that building--it makes a nice cash flow for them--and to give up that management fee to shed all risk and just the risk of everything that's constantly changing. They don't have to stay on top of anymore giving passing that baton over to a company that stays on top of it works with the right people, the right insurance, the right GCs to keep that building running healthy for a long time is who we're really looking for. Someone that we can form a relationship with. We're not just there for just the management. We want to be a partner to it and provide them the highest level of service that we originally started our roots in, which is commercial real estate.
KH: Right. And it sounds like you'd bring a real peace of mind in that scenario where somebody's kind of at the end of where they want to manage their property and they want to hand it over to a pro.
And I'll vouch for Jeremy. I've known Jeremy my entire life. He's such a good guy. I really truly believe in what you're doing out there in the community for San Diego. Jeremy also contributes his time to Miracle League, which is a fabulous, very important part of San Diego as far as a nonprofit. And I'm just so proud to be your friend.
JD: Appreciate that. You know, we're here to help. I understand management comes at a cost. Oftentimes there's an opportunity to offset that expense that you see from management fees. So we're really pushing for families and owners that, looking for retirement, that want to hand over their asset that they worked really hard. And we're going to honor how hard they work to make that deal and to hold it for so long and carry out that legacy of management for them.
KH: That's a good point. It's a very good point. Well Jeremy if somebody wants to reach out to you. How can they get ahold of you?
JD: Yeah, we can attach my email to this post. It's jeremy@denttprop.com Happy to help.
KH: Very cool.
JD: Thanks so much for having me.
KH: Thank you for coming to StudioOne™.
JD: Great introduction to my first podcast.
KH: There you go. Appreciate it.
JD: Thanks.